Good morning!
Welcome to the second instalment of special TNC editions devoted to the making of Combat Rock, The Clash’s fifth album. Today we speak to legendary producer Glyn Johns about how he came on board to turn guitarist Mick Jones’ lengthy version of the record, the now semi-mythical Rat Patrol From Fort Bragg, into the punchy, mega hit-spawning classic, Combat Rock.
This edition is free for all, so please enjoy it and share it widely and freely. If you’d like to subscribe and receive The New Cue direct to your inbox three times a week, just hit that button below. Maybe you’d like to come hang out with us, too? Say, how are you fixed on Friday? Come along to The Social in London for a screening of director Chris Atkins’ brilliant new KLF documentary Who Killed The KLF?. Afterwards, we’ve got a Q&A about the film with Chris. It costs a tenner and you get a free KLF poncho as well. Bargain! Grab your tickets here.
See you there. In the meantime, enjoy this edition.
Ted, Niall and Chris
Line One… Glyn Johns on making Combat Rock
Glyn Johns’ CV as a producer, engineer and mixer is without parallel in rock music. Exile On Main Street, Who’s Next, Led Zeppelin I, Harvest, Ogden’s Nut Gone Flake, Let It Be… in the era of 60s legends, Johns was the go-to guy. He’s also had a bit of a late-career resurgence recently due to his appearance in Peter Jackson’s marathon Beatles documentary Get Back, thanks in part to his amazing collection of dandy-ish outfits (more on those later).
In 1982, Johns received a call from Muff Winwood, brother of Steve and then A&R at CBS records, to see if he would mix and dramatically edit down the latest album The Clash had just delivered. The band had recorded the follow-up to 1980’s 3-LP Sandinista! in New York’s Electric Lady studios. It was a sprawling, 77-minute long record that took in funk, hip-hop, reggae and world music with the working title Rat Patrol From Fort Bragg and – depending on who you talk to – either the label/Joe Strummer/the band’s infamous agent-of-chaos manager Bernie Rhodes wanted to chop guitarist Mick Jones’ mix into something less unwieldy.
From a commercial and artistic point of view, it worked. Re-christened Combat Rock, the album became The Clash’s most successful record and contained two massive transatlantic hits in Rock The Casbah and Should I Stay Or Should I Go. However, it was also the beginning of the end for the band. Drummer Topper Headon was sacked due to his escalating heroin problem before the album’s release, followed by Mick Jones in August 1983. 1985’s woeful Cut The Crap was a Clash album only in name and, realising as such, Strummer dissolved the band the following year.
This Friday, Sony are celebrating the anniversary by issuing a special edition of the album, titled Combat Rock / The People’s Hall. It couples the album with an additional 12 tracks compiled by the remaining members of The Clash (Strummer, of course, sadly died in 2002). The tracks on The People’s Hall chart the period from what was their previous single Radio Clash right up to the release of Combat Rock, including unheard, rare and early versions of tracks.
The disc highlights a new version of Know Your Rights recorded at The People’s Hall on the Rolling Stones Mobile Studio, and the previously unreleased instrumental He Who Dares Or Is Tired. There’s also Futura 2000, an unreleased original mix of The Escapades of Futura 2000, Mikey Dread’s Radio One, and the outtakes The Fulham Connection, previously known as The Beautiful People Are Ugly Too, as well as Idle in Kangaroo Court. Combat Rock / The People’s Hall can be pre-ordered HERE. It will be released on double-CD, triple-vinyl and digital formats, too. As a taster of some of the juicy extras included, here’s The Beat’s Ranking Roger toasting over Rock The Casbah and Red Angel Dragnet…
Chris called up Glyn at his home in West Sussex last week to talk about how he came on board and his experience helping to make the last great Clash album…
Hi Glyn, it’s Chris calling from The New Cue, whereabouts are you today?
I'm near Goodwood in West Sussex. I’m looking out at the pouring rain and thanking God for it because we're in dire need of it.
It’s good for the garden, that’s what my mum always says.
Exactly.
Before we talk about The Clash, I just wanted to ask if you’d been taken aback by the reaction to Get Back?
That’s an understatement! I'm not used to any attention, so it was a bit odd.
Was it weird seeing yourself at work up on the screen over 50 years later?
No, not really. I’ve seen clips of it before. It was a little uncomfortable if anything. Mainly because of the ridiculous clothes I was wearing at the time.
You look cool!
Yeah, a lot of people have that opinion. I, on the other hand, am seriously embarrassed, but there we are. I think Peter Jackson did a brilliant job, so no complaints and I finally got credit for doing what I did.
Check out Glyn’s boating blazer/silk tie combo in this clip from Get Back. Cool as fuck.
From one great record you’ve worked on to another, let’s talk about Combat Rock. Prior to getting the call to work on the album, were you a fan of The Clash?
No, not at all. In fact, all I knew about them was that they were a punk band and I hated punk. I thought punk was disgraceful, so I completely ignored anything to do with them. When I got the call from Muff Winwood, who was at CBS at the time, mentioning that he’d had this album delivered to him and he wasn't very happy with it and asking if there anything I could do with it, my immediate response was: “No thanks, I’m not at all interested”. He said, “Well, have a listen before you say anymore…” I said “OK, I’ll listen to it since it’s you, Muff.” I listened to it and I was blown away. I had no idea that they were such good musicians, never mind about the production of the record and the writing of the songs, etc. So I had my eyes opened. The obvious problem as much as anything was it was too long.
You’d come through working with The Rolling Stones, The Who, The Small Faces, The Beatles. The punk bands came up saying they were going to wipe your generation away. Was there a feeling that those bands you knew and worked with had become the old guard?
You know, I never really had a discussion about it. I was too busy! I based my opinion on punk on the Sex Pistols, who I thought were absolutely atrocious. I hated the violence and unpleasantness about the whole thing and there was nothing musical about them at all. I thought it was disgraceful, so I put everything else in the same bag until I was forced to listen to what became Combat Rock. I thought the standard of musicianship alone - Topper was a great drummer, Mick Jones was a really good guitar player, really innovative in his style of playing and the sounds he got, and obviously Joe’s unbelievable ability to make social commentary in his lyrics. The whole thing was just extraordinary. I was blown away. I thought it was really clever and I found there was a sense of humour that ran through the whole thing which I appreciated. I immediately rang Muff Winwood and agreed to have a go.
In terms of what CBS asked you to do, did they say, ‘We’ve got a version of this album and it’s nearly an hour-and-half long we need you to cut it down to a single album...’ Was that the extent of your brief?
Muff didn’t suggest that it should be a single record, that was my suggestion. It was quite self-indulgent is what it was. And I think if any artist produces themselves, that's likely to happen. It’s terribly difficult for any creative person to be that objective about what they're doing. The same applies to me when I'm mixing. I like the artist to be there because I want their approval on what I'm doing because it's their career apart from anything else – it’s their life on the line. I'm quite capable of making a decision if I have to, but I much prefer to have what my suggestion might be approved by them. For an artist it’s terribly difficult to be objective about what you're doing, which is why record producers exist I suppose.
The Clash had just come off the back of Sandinista! , which was a triple album. Was there a worry that they would just get more sprawling and more self-indulgent?
To be honest with you, I don't know anything about their previous records at all. I've never listened to anything and I had no idea that they’d made a triple album! I fell on my feet because I worked only with Joe who proved to be the most delightful individual to be in a room with and incredibly pleasant and bright and enthusiastic and open to any idea that I had. It was just brilliant. We hit it off immediately and remained friends thereafter. We did it at my place in Sussex and it took us three days.
It only took you three days?! Was Mick around?
Mick turned up very late on the first day. He came in the evening. We've been working since 10 o'clock in the morning. I think I'd done three mixes by then. He came in and he wasn't best pleased to be there. I played him the three mixes and he made comments about all of them that were negative and basically asked me to re-do them taking in mind his suggestions. I said, “Well, if you’d been here at ten o’clock in the morning like you were supposed to and had something to say then I would have of course taken that into account. However, you weren’t and as far as I’m concerned, I’ve done these three and they’re finished.” That didn’t go down terribly well, so he left and wasn’t best pleased. I called Muff the following morning and said: “I don’t think this is a good idea, it doesn’t appear that I have the support of the entire band here and I can’t be bothered with it.” Muff rang me back and said it had all been dealt with and Joe’s going to come on his own and the others have given their approval for whatever you do, they’re leaving it to Joe and you. So I carried on.
I think Joe likened Mick at the time to Elizabeth Taylor in a bad mood…
Haha! I don't blame Mick at all for being not best pleased. He delivered the album the way he wanted it to be and there were other people saying he couldn't have his way. I don't blame him at all, but he didn't show any respect to the process by not appearing until the end of the first day and he seemed to think that I had nothing better to do than to re-do what I’d already done, so he got both barrels as far as I was concerned. We made up once the album was finished and it got released, we got on fine, but I only saw him a couple of times. I recorded them live at Shea Stadium when they opened for The Who. That was the last time I saw them all.
It's nice that Mick could put his hands up and be happy with what you’d done. It was the most successful record they made, after all.
I don't know how happy he was with it. I'm sure he still preferred his version and he was perfectly entitled to. I don't blame him at all. I did blame him for not turning up on time. But other than that, I completely understood where he was coming from. If the roles have been reversed, I wouldn't have been happy either. The fact that it was their most successful record, as far as I'm concerned, is completely down to the fact that the songs that were on it were cut brilliantly by them and written and performed brilliantly by them. I was very fortunate to have it land on my lap. A lot of the songs were too long, they were self-indulgent, so I made it a little more easy to listen to just by keeping everyone's attention and not letting it get too boring.
Combat Rock has The Clash’s two biggest hits on it, Should I Stay Or Should I Go and Rock The Casbah. When you got the tape of Mick’s version did those jump out to you as potential hit records?
No, I don't recall that. I can remember sitting and listening to it and being impressed by the whole thing and realising that there was a lot of stuff on there that probably shouldn't be. But equally, there was other material that was very, very strong. I don't recall thinking I've got a couple of hits here. I did hack a lot of it about, but again, it was all with Joe's approval. I wouldn't have dreamt of doing anything unless he was happy with it.
It must have been quite a job taking a 77-minute album down to a 45-minute one, that’s some serious editing. Let alone while sitting next to the signer who’s written all the songs you’re hacking to pieces.
I didn't find that difficult because Joe was very supportive and I was given completely free rein so it was enjoyable. We became friends. He was a really good guy. My overriding memory of the whole process was being able to sit in the room with Joe. He was great to work with and I really enjoyed his company.
It says a lot about Joe as a person that he could do that without any ego.
Bloody right! Absolutely.
Are there any tracks for you that stand out as favourites?
No, I don't remember any details. I've made nine million records and it was 40 years ago. I don't have a copy of it, even. No disrespect to the record.
Despite its commercial success, Combat Rock was essentially the beginning of the end of The Clash. Topper was fired and not soon afterwards so was Mick. Were you aware that all wasn’t well in the band?
I had no idea about the relationship between anybody in the band. I didn't know there was a problem between anybody and no one ever mentioned that to me. I had a bit of a problem with Mick and that was resolved. The next time I saw them was Shea Stadium and someone asked if I wouldn’t mind recording them there.
Did you go back after working with the Clash and revaluate any other Clash or punk records?
No, no, no. I’m too busy! I was very happy with what I’d done and I moved on.
Thanks for talking to us Glyn, I hope the rain does your garden some good.
Thank you. It was my pleasure.
CC